Cacao Criadero Blog

The DNA test for Acey proves that she is aabbdd, a solid Lilac.

It also gives me the genetic information for Frosty and Nova, which means they have to be aabbDd and aaBbdd, to have a solid Lilac kitten.

Genetically they can have Chocolate, Black, Lilac and Blue Chantilly kittens. 25 % chance for each color, but a litter can be any number of each or just one of the colors.

Tabby is not in any of their genes, so all kittens should be solid.

I plan to mate them once more at the end of next year since the first mating only resulting in one single kitten.  After that I need to bring in a new female for Frosty.

 

The bad thing is that the Chantilly is on the brink of extinction, so she might be hard to find.

 

 

We all know that there are kitten mills around and that some breeders not always stay within the standard of the breed or keep it ethical. 

I am re-posting a statement from my breeder friend, Annie, which she posted on FB. (With her permission of course) .  Annie has been a Breed Chair for the Chantilly with ACFA. She KNOWS the Chantilly breed in and out. Her warning should be listened to. 

By Annie Davenport-Parini
-"Buyer Beware: I have been a professional cat breeder for over a decade. My kittens are all over the US, and now in Canada, and Norway. I work with two breeds, Norwegian Forest Cat, and my beloved Chantilly, that is teetering on extinction. It has come to my attention that there is a possible Chantilly kitten mill in Canada. There are three locations: Calgary, Alberta and Toronto, Ontario, and in British Columbia. This so called Cattery goes by the name of Kings of Siam. The cat they are presenting as a Chantilly has a mask...Chantilly never present with a mask. This cat also has blue eyes...Chantilly never present with blue eyes. This cat looks like a cross between their Siamese and Balinese. PLEASE, if you are looking to adopt a Chantilly, DO NOT GO TO THIS CATTERY until they are proven legitimate! I am in the process of investigating Canadian registries, and also American registries in an effort to at least stop their so called Chantilly program. I received an email from a lady who had tried to adopt a Chantilly from Kings of Siam, and they told her that the male kitten was going to be bred back to its mother, since she is the only female available for their Chantilly breeding program! In the meantime, please be aware that there are NO legitimate Chantilly kittens for adoption in the WORLD at the moment. Your legitimate Chantilly Catteries are: Amorino Cattery, operated by Annie Davenport-Parini located in southern Illinois; Cacao Criadero Cattery operated by Norma Hubenbecker, located in Norway, and LePors Cattery operated by Anne-Marie Brown in Nova Scotia, Canada. Please, anyone else claiming to have Chantilly kittens DO NOT. Thank you." 
 
 
 
 

After months of waiting, Frosty's pedigree finally came in the post today.  I was curious, not only for his ancestors, but to see if it would help me determind what Acey's true color could be, based on the colors of the cats in the pedigree. I know Nova's pedigree, Nebelungs for generations, and therefor the color Blue.

In Frosty's pedigree I found a great-grandfather of Acey with the color lilac and a great,great,great-grandfather with the color cinnamon. Acey's grandfather was a chocolate tabby, grandmother solid chocolate. What recessive genes may have been hidden to emerge now ? 

Well, I am no wiser. Frosty's recessive genes in combination with Nova's color could give different results. So then there is science to decide the whole thing. A DNA-test will give me an answer so that I do not have to guess. I have found a company in Australia that can give me the correct answer online. I order the swabs and they test her DNA. That will tell me what her dominant and recessive genes are when it comes to her color. Or rather what to call her color.  In bad light it looks grey, in good light she is brown. 

Lilac, cinnamon or something else ? 

 

 

 


The birth of Acey has brought me back to my book on genetics : Robinson's Genetics for Cat Breeders & Veterinarians.  

Her fur color has proved not to be very easy (for me at least) to determind. I have the breeders of both her parents (Dam and Sire) advicing me, but they can not give me a definite answer either. One reason is that it is not easy to get the exact right fur color on a photograph send by e-mail to the other side of the planet, and also Acey's fur seems to change color by what light the room has. Sometimes she seems grey (blue) and sometimes she seems to be light brown.

Having a father of the color solid Chocolate and a mother of the color solid Blue, genetics should be easy, but it is not.

Robinson's :

" The basic laws of heredity are relatively simple. They can be reduced to two concepts :

1. The law of separation of the genes in the germ cells.

2. The law of independent assortment of the genes in various crosses. " 

 

In various crosses, yes !  There are dominant genes and there are recessive genes. So even if the dominant genes will win, you do not know what recessive genes that is hidden from being seen. And what if a recessive gene meets another recessive gene ? Then the kitten can end up with a fur color that was not expected.

 

There are something called the agouti or non-agouti.  Tabby or solid.   

There are mutaded colors.

There are diluted colors and dilute modifier. And more.......

All of this gives different results.

 

That is why a pedigree is a place to look for answers in what colors could be inherited.

My problem is that I only have the mother Nova's pedegree at the moment. And that one should be a easy one, her ancestors are all solid blue.  It is Frosty's , the fathers pedigree, that could hide the answer.  Even if he is a solid Chocolate,there are some other colors in his pedigree, tabbies as well. The problem is that the cat organisation that is sending me a copy of his pedigree has had some problems with their pedigree program. Computer programs are known to cause problems sometimes. But they claim it is in the mail now, on its way to Norway.........................

So I am looking at Acey and thinking is she blue, cinnamon, lilac, fawn, cream, smoke etc ?

Some of these colors have been easy to rule out, some not so easy.

At the moment Lilac is the one in question, depending on which genetic advise I find on the internet. Lilac is a diluted brown. And one place it says "a rosier shade of blue", another place " a light taupe grey". The last could fit, but then I find another place that says Lilac cats ALWAYS have the same color on pawpads and nosepads. Well, Acey do not. Her pawpad is quite pink and her nosepad is kind of dark.   So I am not sure any more.........

 

 

In short :

A is for tabby, a is for non-tabby.  

B is for black, b is brown mutated from black,  

D is for dense, dd for dilute.   

 

And there are several more,too. And all matters.................

 

The genotype of Lilac is aabbdd. 

 

Frosty , a solid Chocolate, might be aabbD-  (the dash is for unknown D or d)   

Nova , a solid Blue, might be aaB-dd    (the dash for unknown , B or b)

 

Depending on the unknown, Acey could be Lilac, but the "rosier shade of grey" does not sound right, though.......................

 

And is she a tabby or is she not ? She has some light stripes on her tail and some darker markings on her forhead that could look something like the letter M, which is a tabby marking. The rest of her body seems to be of solid color. So are the stripes just "Ghost-markings" that can appear in kittens and later "disappear", or is she a tabby ? But the tabby gene (A) is dominant, so why is not her father tabby then ? 

 

I could wait some months to see how her fur coat develops, but I am strongly thinking about sending her DNA to an animal DNA Lab in Australia !! 

 

No more guessing, up with science !    Smiler

 

Here I will tell about the everyday life in my cattery as well as small and big events.

Nyeste kommentarer

07.07 | 08:20

Hi,
My name is Johan and I am wondering if you have any nebelung cats nog, I live in sweden, we can talk more if you have any, working Thats why its short text.

07.07 | 22:18

Hi Norma,

I hope my information reaches you. Wanted to know if you breed Turkish Angoras; I am looking for one. I am Monica Newsom makitaylor@msn.com USA.

26.04 | 15:39

Hi good morning all right, I would like to know how much the nebelung puppy is and if you send it to other countries.

19.03 | 18:26

Hi! I’m in Washington, USA. Have a 13 yr old Chantilly and looking for another! Mine was rescued (with her brother in Spokane) but both sterilized. Help?